Post by hidenseekremastered on Dec 5, 2013 22:24:09 GMT -5
Thanks, considering starting from the beginning again after taking a look at that website, there is some really well hidden items it's hard to believe. I've been carefully searching every nook and cranny of each map and I somehow managed to miss the dude that gives you the hair color option, now I find out I missed some other cool things.
Post by hidenseekremastered on Dec 9, 2013 16:43:16 GMT -5
What about this one? this glitch happens during the collapse of the island after you defeat Dorman. Instead of hitting the switch to unlock the door, you can take a short cut and fall off to the left of the staircase. You can also fall off the right of the staircase and get stuck permanently, and also walk over some of the map.
I can't remember for sure, but I did have trouble finding one, and I believe that one was it. I think maybe I found it eventually, but I seem to remember there being more than one such area than in the picture. I'll definitely look into it again whenever I play through the English patch (may not be for a while, as there are other things I'd like to do first).
"What would you do for a Khonsclard bar?" - Shiden
Just finished playing through it in English, and I must say, the plot is a bit, well, boring. Well, more like they could've done so much more with it - I don't know how to describe it, but it feels like they could've expanded a lot more on certain story elements. Still, it's nice to be able to play this in English, and I'm very grateful for that.
That said, I came across some minor errors during my playthrough; the other stuff I came across was already covered by other people, or is just stuff that was already in the Japanese version.
- Silver Pedestal (for reference, the hidden item found here) description just says "ense.", similar to the Isios Brush text error someone reported on your site. - The hidden MP ring that negates MP cost (this item) is called "Spirit Font" when finding it, but "MP Saver" in the item menus - Karion before boss fight: "And to go further, you first get past me." I'm guessing you intended it to read along the lines of "you first must get past me"? - Stein to Massea after Kefin people warp out: "The city's cleared out,but[...]". No space after the comma.
Again, really minor errors, but just mentioning them if you ever polish up the patch.
"What would you do for a Khonsclard bar?" - Shiden
Post by lordfalconer on Dec 19, 2013 19:58:26 GMT -5
I just wanted to say thanks for finally completing this patch. True Ys V may not be the best game in the series but I still had a blast playing it all the same. I even found some of the oddly parpy music quite enjoyable. It feels great being able to play the complete 1-7 now.
Lair is a romanization of "REA" used exclusively on Ys Book I & II for the TurboGrafx-16 CD. While also not my favorite, it is just as accurate as Reah, so it's fine.
This actually isn't quite correct: the way you pronounce Reah (even in Japanese) is different from the way one would pronounce Lair, even if we take the whole European thing going on in the Ys series in account and use British English.
IMHO, Lair is more of a bastardization than a romanization.
The reason many translation patches stick to that name is because that game was the main initial contact western Ys fans had with Ys, so the naming was intended to be continued on with the patches, many of which were translated by Deuce. Likewise, Dogi was going to continue to be named "Colin", but it wasn't because Ys III on the TurboGrafx changed it back to Dogi before such patches came (and "Colin" is a bit inaccurate).
(Also, fwiw, I've released the Mask of the Sun fix too. It even brings the translation up-to-date with official XSEED Memories of Celceta terminology.)
As Xalphenos showed, Lair and Reah are pronounced absolutely exactly the same way by the Japanese, no less, no more. Both romanizations are perfectly accurate. Neither is a bastardization in any way.
As for the second quote, I don't see why it's even there: never did I say I disagree with "Reah" or imply MotS' patch shouldn't have changed her name, or whatever you may be implying. That should not be addressed to me.
Nostalgia vs. Consistency in the case of Reah's name. Falcom says it's Reah, XSEED says it's Reah, even Atlus USA says it's Reah. I think it's possible that it was simply missed by Deuce, instead of him not wanting it in the translation.
You are not really being any more consistent by choosing "Reah" if your reasoning is that "Falcom and XSEED and Atlus are doing it". The situation is actually so grim, that even if you purely stick to Falcom alone, there will be inconsistencies. (Character "Toal Fact" in Ys Origin, and locale "Noble District of Toal" in Ys II, where in the former Falcom RE-ROMANIZED as "Thor", while still calling the place "Toal" once they ported Ys I & II to the PSP later.) Plus, nor Atlus OR XSEED for that matter uses Falcom's own romanizations quite often, because as you well know, Falcom's English sucks, and sometimes because they feel whimsical. XSEED's romanizations ALSO sometimes lack credibility (no offense intended to the staff), with "Cruxie" being one of the biggest offenses that comes to mind. Falcom never stepped back from calling what we call "Fact" as "Fukt" in every single romanization to date, either, yet Atlus/XSEED disagrees. Afterall, we just don't pick "Fukt", because it's  not what we are used to and  that sounds awkward in English, but that's the language's problem, not the name Fukt. "Fukt" is a perfectly valid romanization.
So in both consistency and conformity, the series fails, unless if we stick to katakana, Falcom-given names. Then there's no way to be wrong.
In the end, defending one thing over the other is pointless. XSEED isn't some Falcom representative in the west, it's just a temporary 3rd party partner like any other over Ys' history, just like how Konami, Atlus, Hudson and others were. In-house they got a translator or two, and are in no way related to the canon of anything Ys: they just localize to the best of their abilities.
What DOES have a point, though, is to make sure people understand what is what. Alienation from new non-Japanese Ys fans due to naming inconsistency is, sadly, inevitable, especially since there's no guarantee XSEED will be around doing it forever, and/or that they will always have the same translation team, and/or that Falcom won't eventually choose a new partner with different decisions, and/or that Falcom will make their own office elsewhere themselves.
What we CAN do, though, is try to patch up any confusion due to naming by suggesting known, as long as accurate, translated names, so we are heard by those involved in the activity of translating and releasing Ys games, and cheer once the requirement is met. Not change it every single time a 3rd party (or 1st party, for Falcom's shame) decides on a different name. Imagine re-patching EVERY single Ys game released in English EVERY single time that happened. Crazy ass work! And in the end, what is really accomplished?
Nothing. For there would be no end!
By the way, MP83, don't forget Ys Book I & II for the TurboGrafx 16 CD got re-released on the Wii Virtual Console Internationally more or less around the time Atlus brought the series over through the DS, as well. Just found that relevant to point out.
tl;dr : I personally would move on, on the Lair/Reah/Leah/Rair/Lare/Rare/Lea/Rea case. It is literally doing no harm, and is perfectly fine.
Last Edit: Dec 26, 2013 17:00:27 GMT -5 by Red Hairdo
Post by Red Hairdo on Dec 26, 2013 18:28:32 GMT -5
1. "h" is added so the pronunciation of the vowel is forced to be pure. ("a" is forced NOT to be pronounced as "ei", and is forced to be pronounced as "a"). There is no other reason the romanization "Reah" is so gramatically accepted, myself included! Edit: Oops, it wouldn't be "ei" otherwise, but the role of the "h" is as specified: to get the purest "a" possible.
Also, where I live is irrelevant to any of this. How in the world would that be relevant?? Also, you mustn't check Google's output for Lair's English pronunciation, obviously, of all things! It's as nonsensical as getting Google to pronounce "the" in English for you, then either "ji" or "za" in Japanese (the way the Japanese pronounce "the"). Of course you will get different results.
2. Then you were mistaken, because it wasn't about people caring about its reasoning or not: you yourself, and possibly others, were wondering why Lair's name was kept despite Gideon Zhi's statement. The reasoning is relevant, because it's not due to XSEED being the current main localization company that others should not choose different localization names for their English Ys patches, for perhaps the reasoning behind "Lair" being kept and "Reah" not might have a greater weight than XSEED's input on Ys I&II Chronicles. Or not. Depends on whoever is doing the patch/localization! It also served as an emphasis to the fact "Lair" wasn't chosen or kept out of blind bias: if you understood the reason, you perhaps would have not asked "why". Especially since even otherwise it's obvious: Gideon talked of XSEED's YsC's translation, not of overall XSEED decisions, including naming. It doesn't matter anything out of the range Gideon specified.
3. They certainly have a partnership going on, and yeah, as far as naming goes (except naming of Roos or Piccards, or passwords, or whatnot...), they don't randomly pull shit out of their asses, as you said, for overall naming. Sadly, though, we all are just human, and therefore faulty, so things like "Cruxie" happened (both Wyrdwad and I, although us both were too late, ended up finding out the name Falcom was most likely going for was "Cloche"). So it's not like it's purposeful, but many localized names end up either being  arbitrary (such as with "Reah") or  wrong ("Cruxie"). As long as the staff tried, then there're no regrets. But likewise, those things shouldn't be "worshipped", ya know. You can be fond of them as long it doesn't reach the point you lose flexibility.
4. You just defended the usage of "Reah" over "Lair"... if you moved on, you'd have been indifferent to the usage of either. =| That's what I meant.
Last Edit: Dec 26, 2013 18:39:03 GMT -5 by Red Hairdo
Oh, FFS. Lair was originally kept because it was what I grew up with, and is what I still prefer. I started changing it to match XSEED only for consistency's sake. It still sneaked into the updated Ys IV patch due to an oversight. Nothing more. A correction will be up to Gideon to release.
I'm just going to pop in and thank Deuce and Gideon so much for the patch. I definitely enjoyed it even though the (lack of) difficulty was pretty pathetic and the fact that you never really need to use magic was a waste of an otherwise interesting system. Hopefully Expert fixes a few of those problems. Now on to Celceta!
-------------------------------- Legend of Heroes: A Tear of Vermilion (PSP)
Rogue Legacy (PS4)
Holy shit I'm so late to the party. I've been lurking these forums for years, waiting for updates on translations and things like that. It's only now that I see that this patch actually got released! Awesome! Thank you so much to everybody involved in the project!