Illegal game copy

[sargon]

Hope its ok to open this kind of discussion.
I am confused about you guys.
On one hand, you buy Ys games and try to support falcom.
On the other hand, I read that you are downloading illegal copies of games? or that you are hacking consoles?
I myself try to have only legal software.
I have original windows, original everything. I think.
I admit that the only illegal thing I have on my computer is a sega master system emulator with roms.
In my foolishness I thought its legal to use emulators and roms of old consoles(Even if you don't have the copy of the game)
So maybe its time I will delete it.
Do you have only legal games? illegal? what are your justification for illegal copies?
When will you get an illegal copy of a game?
This issue is sensetive to me, because I am developing a game myself. And I wouldn't be happy if someone put an illegal copy of it for download.
Again, sorry if this topic will start an awefull flame war.
I am not sure I am allowed to post about it.

[Red Hairdo]

Hmm... well, I have a few things to say:

- Be careful not to generalize. In this board (and everywhere else) you'll meet people that use illegal copies of stuff and these who don't.

- One's world reality varies from member to member. (From the looks of things, I think you live in the US, right?) This kind of thing is kind of complicated, this has been once discussed somewhere in this board section, in some topic (forgot which one).

- Some companies are dead, but they still own the copyright. Teorically downloading i.e. a PC Engine game is an illegal act if you don't delete it within 24 and don't have an original copy of it. But in reality it will make zero difference to the market, as such companies won't profit from their old products, as they are not being sold anymore since long ago.

- Other stuff. xD But I think you get the idea by now.

[sargon]

Yea, my generalization origins from my lack in expressive capabilities.
I am sorry if that was the impression.
p.s. I don't live in the U.S.

[FM-77AV]

I totally support piracy. I think it's great. The advantages to buying stuff are so many it's ridiculous. I'm too lazy to list them now though (because that list would be HUGE).

There's a political party for piracy in Sweden, called Piratpartiet (The Piracy party). In the next election, I will vote for them.

Of course, there are negative aspects too, in some cases, like downloading something from poor people, like really unknown bands and stuff.

I will never support big companies though, by buying games or movies and shit.

And I don't want a bunch of crap littering my home. I can't stand cds, dvds and all that garbage. If someone gave me the option to get cds and dvds for free (but not be able to sell them/give them away) or just pirate them like usual, I would definitely go for the latter. Not a doubt in my mind. I've thrown away so much of this crap lately. I don't want it!

Ugh, just thinking about it makes me want to move into the woods or something. Just abandon it all. I hate things!

[Yakra]

Aug 22, 2008 14:32:32 GMT -5 sargon said:

Do you have only legal games? illegal? what are your justification for illegal copies?

I think if I gathered all the games I own, of each and every console over the ages, I would probably come up with 30 original copies... perhaps. I might be over counting.

Quite honestly I love originals. They're pretty, they come in pretty boxes, they don't feel like cheap rubbish and well... they're original! (I love collecting stuffs! Nice pretty shiny orderly stuffs which don't have over pixelized excuses for covers.) But one doesn't get original copies easily here. And when one does at times, they be expensive! (that's when you ask the game shop people to specially order a game for you, and if you're lucky you might get it. And you have to buy it at whatever price they say.)

But in the end, over the years, I've realized.. I don't mind these nice piraters all that much! If not for them, I would never have gotten all the games I have. And if the companies can't care enough to actually send originals to Pakistan/if Pakistani shops couldn't care enough to stock up from these companies - blah to them! I shall download online and burn myself a copy!

Ofcourse, if there's a game I realy like, then I usually try everything everything to get myself an original copy. Even if I already own a pirated version.

This issue is sensetive to me, because I am developing a game myself. And I wouldn't be happy if someone put an illegal copy of it for download.

I can kind of relate to that though. :'D Sometimes, I feel like this kind of attitude will come back to me (one's actions coming back to haunt one!) and some grand art thief will start pirating/printing copies of my works! (And I would like to stab that person a thousand times!)

[sargon]

FM-77, if the game you want can be purchased in download form, with no hard copy. Do you still look for pirated copy?

[Justin]

I support it to a point.

I am very avid about preserving our electronic history for other generations to experience. Cart and CD formats have short life spans, and I like to be able to play a back up instead of my original so as to keep it in good condition.

If its not on a shelf, and there are no more copies officially produced, then I don't see how it hurts the parent company. They have made their money from merchant purchases anyways.

Sometimes if a game is expensive (Ys Origin) I will pirate the game, see if its good, and if it is then I will buy the real copy.

If a game is simple enough to pick up in a store, from ebay, or a friend, then I usually don't bother. I am a nut for having the box and whatnot, plus it looks coool as hell on my shelfs.

Most people here have a very "NO" stance when it comes to piracy, but it doesn't mean the members here are "scolded" or frowned upon for it. We are a very diverse community here, and whether you like it or not, a gamer who pirates games is just as much of a video game nut than a gamer who doesn't.

[FM-77AV]

Aug 22, 2008 16:00:20 GMT -5 sargon said:

FM-77, if the game you want can be purchased in download form, with no hard copy. Do you still look for pirated copy?

If the game was developed by an individual or a small group of people, then no. If the game has a demo mode, and I consider it good enough (not likely), I might pay for it.

For big companies: yes. I will pirate it. And especially considering these "legit" downloads usually require you to install "malware" on your computer (Steam, etc) and contains even more "viruses" in the game itself (DRM, online validation, etc).

Aug 22, 2008 16:04:27 GMT -5 Justin said:

Most people here have a very "NO" stance when it comes to piracy.

I'm willing to bet it's the opposite. I know a that lot of people will SAY they're against piracy, but pirate on their own. They're ashamed of their awesome secrets. They shouldn't be. They should be proud pirates. Real pirates are a proud people. And ambitious. Look at the staff behind The Pirate Bay. These are without a doubt some the most ambitious, and influental people in the world. They're completely unstoppable. They even tried to make their own pirate COUNTRY! Although, they failed. Why? Because they were asking for donations to be able to buy it. Donations? From pirates? Good luck. They should've known they had it coming.

Although, they did actually make quite a bit of money. But I don't remember what they did with it.

[Justin]

Yeah that "no" was in quotation marks for a reason. I everyone is guilty of it one way or another, even the topic creator with his Sega CD collection.

[Incog Neato]

YOU DON'T LIKE PIRATES!? THEM'S FIGHTIN' WORDS!

Seriously though, I pirate all over the place -- I download music, games, and movies. However, for games, I do it mostly to try them out. If I like them enough, I'll buy them and nuke the pirated copy. In fact, I believe I finished Felghana by playing the Jolly Roger version. I later purchased it from Falcom (cuz I was waiting for them to release the freakin' regular edition) though.

I also buy things if they take too long to download. :P But for software applications that I use a lot and are under $100 US, I'll probably shell out money for them too just to stop the risk of getting a bloody trojan virus on my system again.

Now if there's one thing I don't agree about on software companies are their stupid IDENTICAL prices on retail in-store versions AND on-line downloads. I don't see the damn justification for that. If I buy it from the store, I get a box and either an evelope or case for the media and maybe the manual too. But if I buy it online, I just get the program and, for some reason, IT'S THE SAME GODDAMN PRICE. What gives?!?!?

To me, this means that either the packaging and shit don't cost anything (which is hard to believe) or that they're ripping off customers through their Websites since they're paying for crap they're not getting.

Oh, and Red, as far as I know, it doesn't matter if you have a pirated something for a second or 24 hours. It's still illegal. :P Piracy is more about the act and not the owning of the Jolly Roger'd thing.

[FM-77AV]

The packaging and disc DOESN'T cost a thing! That's why the price is the same. You pay for the work put into the product, not the media it's on. The media is obsolete.

[Incog Neato]

Aug 22, 2008 19:32:16 GMT -5 FM-77AV said:

The packaging and disc DOESN'T cost a thing! That's why the price is the same. You pay for the work put into the product, not the media it's on. The media is obsolete.

That's silly! Does that justify the price Adobe charges for their stuff then? But I guess with that GIANT list of credits in Photoshop ...

[Red Hairdo]

Aug 22, 2008 19:16:24 GMT -5 Incog Neato said:

Oh, and Red, as far as I know, it doesn't matter if you have a pirated something for a second or 24 hours. It's still illegal. Piracy is more about the act and not the owning of the Jolly Roger'd thing.

I heard that if you only have something pirated for 24 hours or less to see if you like it, it isn't something illegal... But that's what I heard. I also think it's illegal anyway, and I think many sites put these words in just to potentially avoid some trouble.

[Musa-Revived]

I only support stuff that I really really want. Like Falcom games. But not the 100 over other games that I amassed from the internets

And electronic download purchases suck. It feels like you're paying for nothing. I'd still pay for a cd with a nice box and manual and extras.

Most of the time, I'll still buy the original after I tried the pirate and really like it. Then when the sequel comes, I'd preorder it without second thought, like the Zwei series.

It's a chicken and egg thing, companies produce stuff, pirates appear, companies impose protection and encryption, and the honest fellas feel the end of the stick. And when the honest fellas get too pissed, they turn to the pirates. Yet the companies will never change and impose even stricter protection and the remaining honest consumer gets screwed even harder.

[Kimimi]

I always buy originals, but I don't think th sky will fall if somebody downloads Bahamut Lagoon or plays Golden Axe on MAME.

However I don't think somebody with an SD card full of DS games has any right to say they own 150 (or whatever) DS titles; and I accept that in some countries getting originals is incredibly difficult and expensive but as somebody who has to pay the equivalent of $80 - $100 for a domestic 360/PS3 game, as standard, I do get a little annoyed by some of the moaning American kids on GameFAQs.

[Justin]

Gamefaqs... such an immature site, unless you find that perfect board to hang at... unfortunately they only ever last so long.

[MonoTekETeA]

Aug 23, 2008 0:47:47 GMT -5 Kimimi said:

However I don't think somebody with an SD card full of DS games has any right to say they own 150 (or whatever) DS titles

That is rediculous! Own?! Lol, they ought to be slapped.

Heh, really, now-a-days. I just simply mod for the experience. The experience to see if I can actually figure out how to do it, and get it working well. Just to say I did it. Whether it is cutting a hole in a case of my Wii, and placing a serial port in it so I can hardwire remove my mod chip, or if it is figuring out how to make dual disk ps1 roms work on my PSP. Just figuring it out.

Granted, I am not at the head of the pack, deciphering programing, and REALLY figuring it out, but you get the idea.

I have over 1500+ DS roms downloaded, I own about 7 games for the DS, and the last time I played a game for the DS was over a year ago.

I am currently in the middle of softmodding a slim PSP. What I will most likely play on there is simply Puzzle Quest, which has fatal bugs in it, and a PS1 rom of Magical Drop 3. However I own over 10 RPGs or so for the darn system, still sealed.

I understand I am the exception, due to the fact of all the rediculous things I do, when there is no need for it. It is kinda like when people steal...even though they have no need to. Heh, I guess what can I say. I am no role model for this board to look up to morally in this particular sense. But I personally mean no harm to the industry. I should also mention I play games for about 5 hours a month. "But Mono, why are you on these boards?" That is just how embedded I am in the gaming culture...

I don't know how ya should interpret this message, it is simply a description of me and piracy. Use it to gain a better understanding on the vast variations of people there are out there, even on something as seemingly two dimensional as game piracy.

[Justin]

Seems to me that piracy is much more common than most of us seem to think. I remember taping shows on VHS and BETA back when I was young, or taping my favorite songs off the radio. Coping a buddies new cassette was standard, and mix tapes were very common. For some reason, its become very "political" to do all those things now. Back then it wasn't so taboo, and for some reason its very frowned upon now. Perhaps with the advent of the "Digital Age", where products that don't even physically exist cost money, we have lost a sense of technological freedom. IMO if there wasn't a record button in the first place, I don't think anyone would have thought to copy in the first place.

[Kimimi]

Well as a kid in the 80s I didn't understand the term "copyright infringement"! I think these days you're more likely to get caught and companies have to do less to track who's copying what (as opposed to pre-internet, when you'd have to physically track down duplicates) which is why it seems to be more frowned upon.

[Incog Neato]

Goofy anecdote:

Back in grade 9, I used to play a bunch of C64 games. I think with the exception of about 10 games, my brother basically got games off other people or off the BBSes.

So! When I was playing a good old pirated copy of Ultima V, I got stuck in the final dungeon. Guess what I did? I wrote to Origin looking for hints. I started off the letter by saying I got the game from a friend. >_>

You know what the reply was?

A nice letter explaining that piracy was wrong. :P

I know I still have the letter but I have to go find it.

The NEXT time I wrote to them (for the same hints), I got smart and left out the bit about getting having copied the game from someone. :P

You know, in regards to what MP83 said about everyone pirating way back when, I think it's cuz companies created games not for mere money but because they wanted to see their ideas realized and stuff. Hell, I bet even the programmers shared games with each other. Nowadays, corporations are just frothing over money, pumping out crap franchises, and making shitty movie adaptations.

Has anyone ever noticed that just about every goddamn game based on a movie sucked? What is UP with that?