Poor grammar and misspellings in fan translations

[HJ]

Tales games sell well? Are you sure? I know Symphonia did reasonably well, but aside from that I thought they did bad. Especially Tales of the Abyss.

Of course, that too can be attributed to Bamco's stupidity and terrible marketing. Who releases a niche JRPG at the same time as FFXII is dropping? I've seen a lot of bad moves, but that one takes the cake.

[RyuKisargi]

It boggles the mind, to me.

I've been on sites like Romhacking enough to know that there is -plenty- of fan translations.

I'm pretty sure the reason Square-Enix added in the extra content to Chrono Trigger DS was to be a nod to the community, there's plenty of hacks that add content. (( Though they did stop Crimson Echoes. ))

I personally am hoping to see more companies do what XSeed/Falcom did with Oath of Felghana.

You know what? About that. Did Deuce's translation make it easier for you to release the game here? Would you guys have done the translation yourself if one didn't exist?

[HJ]

Sept 19, 2010 15:34:43 GMT -5 Wyrdwad said:

AFAIK, they've all sold "well enough" to be profitable. As in, well enough that there'd be no reason to think of the series as risky.

But I could be mistaken.

-Tom

Well, I won't claim to know, but you're the first one I've ever heard say this. Everyone else says Abyss and other non-Symphonia games sold horribly.

[HJ]

I'd like for you to translate a game like Half-Minute Hero (wink wink nudge nudge) to see what you're really capable of if you get a first class script in your hand. Not that I found Ys Seven's localization to be a travesty or anything, but Ys games hardly have first class scripts.

[Ascended Mermaid]

Yeah, now if only someone would pay Tomato for his translation of Mother 3 and release it in English-speaking countries! Granted, a GBA release is out of the question now...

[Raison D'etritus]

I hate errors in anime (or other) dubs more than subtitle typos, as they indicate incompetence in the directing. "Professional" works should have a higher quality. (I think we've all been elucidated as to the godlike [narcissistic] superiority of "professional" translations) I recently saw an anime where multiple girls simultaneously stated their "rasin deeahtray." I know the phrase is more common in Japan than America, and likely the reason why it's usually rendered into "reason for being" or "reason for living" along with the translated Japanese, but if it's going to be preserved, it should at least be rendered correctly. (Reminded me of hearing Markwiss throughout FF12) Even if the usual English rendering is inacurate from the native, it's still commonly accepted; we take both Meksico and Mehico, or Moscow and Mosco, but if a voice director lets in Mezzicor or Mauscout, it's pretty grating.

[RyuKisargi]

I personally am looking forward to actually seeing the part where Adol gets the double jump translated, the giant tablet of Genos or whatever it was.

And Raison, I agree. One horrible, horrible recent game?


*shudder* Arc Rise Fantasia. There was -no- emotion in the VAing whatsoever. It sounded like they shoved the script through NaturalReader.

[RyuKisargi]

Arc Rise Fantasia was one of the EXTREME FEW games I bought new.

I turned it on, happy with a good RPG for the Wii, and I was happy.

Until they STARTED TALKING.

I wish, so -hard-, that XSeed had gotten it. Even if you guys couldn't get the VAs right, you would've at least found that out and included a language option or something at the last minute.

I couldn't return it either, 'cause I got it from Gamestop. >_> I did manage to bitch them out enough to get the full amount in store credit (( They had played it before, due to scratches on the disk. )) and that was enough, but still...




Arc Rise Fantasia is like... Teles of Phantasia GBA. It gives RPGs a bad name.

[Peytral]

Sept 19, 2010 17:21:30 GMT -5 Wyrdwad said:

Arc Rise Fantasia was originally going to be one of ours, too...

FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU

[Peytral]

And I was somebody who was looking forward to Arc Rise Fantasia before they even announced an American release, too. ;__;

[Skeletore has a boner]

Sad because ARF has been my favorite RPG of the last 5 or so years, and that's *with* the terrible acting, it could have been so much better.

[megalink101]

Sept 19, 2010 11:56:46 GMT -5 Skeletore has a boner said:

Actually there is no standardized certification agencies in *most* countries, including the US.

There are agencies that will claim to make you a certified translator in the US...about 20 of them, all with varies levels of standards and expectations.

As the person who had the final say in who we hired for my division at Capcom, I can tell you I never once cared about any types of certification. JLPT is nice, but in the US since there is no standard agency there IS NO STANDARD. So all of them are meaningless from the perspective of an employer. Same with most countries, Even France who has much more strict language regulations than Japan doesn't have a standardized test for certification.

Japan is the exception, not the rule.

Skeletore,

What you have written here is absolutely false. There are several non-profit organizations around the world that certify translators using standardized tests, INCLUDING the U.S. That is the reason why professionals make six figures a year and why amateurs make a low five figure salary. If you do not believe me, ask Wyrdwad how much he makes a year at XSEED. I guarantee his salary is probably somewhere in the $20,000~$30,000 range.

Newspapers, technical manuals, and other important information, especially, are never translated by the translator in a "how I feel at the moment attitude." There IS, in fact, a standardized way to do it. You are welcome to talk to the people at www.tls-translations.com if you do not want to take my word for it. Now there is a group of professionals, several of whom bring in hefty six figure salaries a year.

If you still do not trust them, go talk to Amanda Katsurada. Does that name ring a bell? She has worked on several Square-Enix games and what do you know? She IS certified by the American Translators Association. Go figure. You can contact her here:
[phone]

Check out this Q&A on Yahoo and click on the link. You can find companies that offer salaries in the six figure range if you are certified.
answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080514040732AAkMDPq

You can pull the I worked at Capcom card, which is perfectly fine with me, but you are misleading others, and I am giving you solid evidence here that what you are telling people is wrong. You may not care about certifications--and that is your opinion--but the business world does.

I know when people's pride has been injured online, they often pull the "trolling" card, and if I have hurt anyone's pride, I apologize. That was not my intention. However, please understand that there are a lot of people who are seriously misinformed about how business works in Japan.

This is the last thing I will post in this thread, but I want everyone to know that I have been truthful here, and while you are welcome to try and discredit what I have said, the facts remain. Wyrdwad may say fan translations are the way to go, but chances are, you will one day get slapped with a cease and desist order, and all of your work will have been for naught. I think if you are really interested in mastering Japanese, go to a university with a good Japanese program, then go to Japan and study there. Do NOT do the JET program because you cannot focus on Japanese and you will be stuck in some place like an elementary school with little school kids. This will impede your progress in learning the language because you are required to speak English basically all of the time at work. Last of all, GET CERTIFIED. Please do NOT listen to the words of someone who is not certified, they are full of it when they say certifications do not matter. Your salary WILL at least see a two-fold increase if you are certified.

[Skeletore has a boner]

Sorry, but you're being intellectually dishonest here.

I never claimed that there were no agencies THAT CLAIM TO GIVE CERTIFICATION.

I said that they are effectively useless, because there is NO STANDARD.

I could start an agency today that claimed to give certification to translators and have the same amount of vested authority as any of the 20+ agencies.

For the record I am certified on multiple levels, and I consider it a waste of money. Though I do like your "you can pull the worked at Capcom card".

It's like saying "You can pull the "you have experience at a level above me and know what you're talking about card, BUT TRUST ME, BECAUSE I SAID SO".

lol@you.

At the end of the day, your work speaks for your abilities, certificates mean jack.

[Incog Neato]

Sept 19, 2010 13:11:13 GMT -5 Wyrdwad said:

Fan-translation should be about bringing things to fans that no one else will. But sometimes, it seems more like a competition -- who can bring a show to the fans the quickest, who can bring it to them with the most flowery dialogue, etc. It's one thing if another fansub group is doing a lousy job with a show, and you want to bring it to fans with a better translation... but if a previous release is perfectly fine, then why are you releasing it AGAIN? What are you contributing to the fandom?

Yeah, and sometimes, they leave insulting notes (like taking shots at a rival group) before an intro in their fansubs too. >_>

I also find groups that re-release their own works with a newer version due to whatever reason (usually due to rush translations and crap) is kind of annoying. It makes me wonder why they couldn't have taken the time to read over their stuff BEFORE uploading. Kind of crappy work ethics you got there. 9___9

I know they're doing this stuff in their own time and it's not for profit and stuff but I still think there should be some sort of quality control going on.

I bet they just wanted to get their version of the sub up before another group. Sigh.

Er, about what I meant about fan-translators needing editors that know English -- I'm just sick and tired of seeing shit like "it's" in place of "its" and awkward translations like "It is so troublesome" or "It can't be helped" AND .... AND ... OMG ... "NAKAMA" (<-- did I bitch about this already in an earlier post?).

I mean, SERIOUSLY. Take some pride in your own works, people! Just because you're doing this as a hobby shouldn't mean that you throw all English rules out of the window. 9___9

The day I see a group start translating stuff with SMS-like words is the day I will send hate mail to that group.

[Ashurei]

*Ashurei's keen sense of selective hearing has detected mention of War of the Lions*

Sept 19, 2010 23:52:54 GMT -5 Wyrdwad said:

Take "Final Fantasy Tactics: War of the Lions," for example. There's a line in the original Japanese that would literally translate to something like, "If you oppose me, you will die." In the English version, however, the line was translated as something along the lines of, "If you oppose me, the snow will run red with your blood."

That is a liberty being taken. By your precious Square Enix, no less. And EVERY GAME THEY RELEASE does this.

War of Lions has the best script ever written, and even not knowing the original, I can TELL they took multitudes of liberties with it.

And the script is that much better for it.



...that's all I have to add. Nothing substantial!
HAHAHAHAHA.
*poof*

[Incog Neato]

Sept 20, 2010 0:04:03 GMT -5 Ashurei said:

*Ashurei's keen sense of selective hearing has detected mention of War of the Lions*

You HEARD wyrd type that out? Amazing!

[Ashurei]

I did say keen, no?

[HJ]

Actually, the only time the word "oppose" appears in the script is when Folmarv says, "Who is there to oppose us, save you feeble-bodied humans?" Oh, and in a class description, which is clearly irrelevant here. And I can't find any mention of blood that resembles the line you speak of, save for when Meliadoul says, "Hear me, Ramza. When next we meet, your blood will soak the earth!"

I'm not trying to be anal or anything here, I'm just genuinely curious about the line you're talking about and the scene where it's spoken, since I can't remember it. Also, I agree, it does have the best script I've ever seen.

[lailmith]

Sept 19, 2010 23:43:49 GMT -5 Incog Neato said:

I mean, SERIOUSLY. Take some pride in your own works, people! Just because you're doing this as a hobby shouldn't mean that you throw all English rules out of the window. 9___9

The day I see a group start translating stuff with SMS-like words is the day I will send hate mail to that group.

Hey don't be too hard on them. Sometimes they are actually quite hilarious. Don't you think?

I remember watching a show translated by some French people/person. And I must say the way he used English was something I hadn't really seen earlier. Guessing just what the heck is he trying to mean and what it actually meant was quite a comedy :D If it was translated properly I guess I wouldn't have watched it so much as I did. That was the second best example of not-so-english, right after the 'How to pronounce words incorrectly'-tape we listened at school.

But yes... People who suck in English about as much as I do, should really think twice if they really can translate it into ENGLISH. Or at least double-check their work very carefully..

As for the SMS thing. I think I have seen some works with such awesome quality, but fortunately they are rare and hopefully will stay like that.

This is just dahm great.. I totally failed my English exam on the production part and now I'm writing here sentences that make more sense than any of the ones written on the exam.. annoying..

[HJ]

Sept 20, 2010 9:42:47 GMT -5 Wyrdwad said:

I think that last example of yours is the one I was speaking of. Like I said, "or something along those lines."

-Tom

Okay, I was just wondering if it was from a scene in the game that the script FAQ on Gamefaqs had missed.