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Post by Ascended Mermaid on Dec 21, 2009 22:51:31 GMT -5
And, just a tip: save your Magic Nuts for bosses. Pfft! XD Wooow...
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Post by Red Hairdo on Dec 21, 2009 22:57:16 GMT -5
And, just a tip: save your Magic Nuts for bosses. Pfft! XD Wooow... xD Hey! I wanted to make sure something as simple as that would be done; needless to say, those babes are expensive as hell (at least earlier in the game). I thought it'd be better than not to mention it, since he said he may try SoM again on the PSP. Anyway, I forgot to say something in my post that I recalled right after posting it: I really don't think you should be playing that game, Unsavory, as it seems you despise it to the very bottom of your soul for whatever reason. About finishing owned games, I had that kind of habit during the N64 and PS1 eras too, but one day I realized I just... didn't even have to do that: playing a game should be all about fun, and not a chore, in my opinion.
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Post by HJ on Dec 21, 2009 22:58:12 GMT -5
But if you don't level up your magic, will the buff-magic even make that noticable of a difference? I mean, I honestly have no idea, but if it does then you can ignore this part of our argument, since I'll concede it.
I don't know if you're saying all your weapon and magic levels are levelled to their current maximum in perfect accordance with when you get a new crystal and a new magic/weapon level opens up, but if you are then I don't believe you at all. I killed everything more than once, and by the time my weapons were able to be raised to like, level six, most of them were sitting around at level 2 or 3, 4 for the sword. The character's level may be up to par simply by killing everything in your path, but your magic and weapon proficiency sure isn't.
I remember in this one temple, there were some switches you needed to activate using magic, and there were also lots of enemies that could only be killed with magic. I figured that obviously the designers wouldn't be stupid or perhaps cruel enough to make me spend my MP on those fellows if I was gonna need it for switches up ahead. But unfortunately I did, and then an hour of my life had been lost on nothing. By then it was too late for me to know I was supposed to ignore those enemies. Also, I don't remember having that much MP to spare. Did you gain more MP as you levelled up your magic? Because in that case I definitely didn't have much MP to spare.
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Post by Ascended Mermaid on Dec 21, 2009 23:35:08 GMT -5
It's a game that wants to be loved, for sure. I just don't feel that it lives up to the hype. It's like calling Final Fantasy VI the best game ever, when the second half turns out to be a major fetch-quest for your party on a geographically altered world. What SoM and FFVI have in common, is that they're both hyped to death, in spite of their massive, almost game-breaking flaws.
With that said, I'm hoping that the game will convince me that it's worth the time and effort I'm spending on it. If not, it'll still be worth it for the fact that I'm continuing to widdle down on my list of unfinished games. It's like how Julie wanted to try all of the recipes in Julia's cookbook -- I want to beat all of the games in my collection, or as many as I possibly can in my lifetime. Not for fame or anything, but simply because it's a goal; another project.
// hj: You're obviously referring to Salamando's Temple, aren't you? I recall there being two cloud enemies, and a crystal orb. Using "scan", it tells you that Salamando's magic will work. The only problem is, they don't tell you which spell! What did I do? I casted EVERYTHING but Exploder, so I had to go to town, and come back just to use the one spell that would've worked on it. Afterward, I came across another crystal orb, and AGAIN it was Salamando's magic that would work, but it wasn't Exploder this time... puzzles like this are asinine! There's no rhyme or reason for that! Logically in my mind, how am I supposed to deduce that EXPLODER of all magics, will somehow *REDUCE* the heat in that room, so that I may progress?! That's like using an ice cube to keep warm; it doesn't make any effing sense!!!
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Post by HJ on Dec 21, 2009 23:48:35 GMT -5
I forgot the name, but that sounds about right.
And I totally feel you about the game; it's like it's an ugly son and you're the mother. You wanna love it so bad, but... just look at the darn thing, how could you ever really love it?!
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Post by HJ on Dec 21, 2009 23:52:50 GMT -5
Hahaha, yeah, I tend to fly solo when I raise the anti-SoM banner.
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Post by Ascended Mermaid on Dec 22, 2009 1:13:16 GMT -5
I used to be the only one. I reluctantly picked up SoM on the VC to be welcomed by an ovation from Justin "Glad to see you're giving it another shot" -- this was all several months ago, close to a full year! When I got to the desert town, I just let the game sit, for months. Now I'm at the Lofty Mountains. I don't know how long I'm going to let the game sit there, however. I don't feel motivated enough to pick it up again right now. Maybe tomorrow. Maybe a year from now. XD
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Post by HJ on Dec 22, 2009 14:37:04 GMT -5
It was something similar for me. Well, except it wasn't Justin, but another friend of mine. Well, at least you've gotten further than I did.
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Post by Red Hairdo on Dec 23, 2009 17:28:58 GMT -5
But if you don't level up your magic, will the buff-magic even make that noticable of a difference? I mean, I honestly have no idea, but if it does then you can ignore this part of our argument, since I'll concede it. If I recall correctly, the higher the level of the magic, the longer the element would last on the buffed weapon. That means it would last for a longer time, as well as you can hit a target more times before the effect wears off. Also note that if you decide to buff multiple characters on a single casting, the effect naturally won't last as long as well. Regardlessly, to directly answer your question: as far as I know, the magic level doesn't influence the power of the elemental buff. And what I'm sure about is that powering up a weapon with an element in which the boss is weak against can really help a great deal: less (perhaps zero) misses, and greater damage, which works best on the main character, who solely uses melee attacks, and is best at it. There's also one other thing you should keep in mind: to level up a given magic, you actually don't even have to necessarily use it: both the girl and the sprite gain 3 different magics per spirit, and what you actually level up is a given spirit's magic set. So, say, if you use cure magic with the girl a lot, her water element buff will get stronger as well. I don't know if you're saying all your weapon and magic levels are levelled to their current maximum in perfect accordance with when you get a new crystal and a new magic/weapon level opens up, but if you are then I don't believe you at all. I killed everything more than once, and by the time my weapons were able to be raised to like, level six, most of them were sitting around at level 2 or 3, 4 for the sword. The character's level may be up to par simply by killing everything in your path, but your magic and weapon proficiency sure isn't. No, I didn't mean you would get your weapons and magics to their current maximum by simply following that tactic. What I meant is: what I said is required for you to proceed in the game normally, so that you don't have to grind and can keep mostly enjoying the story rather than the gameplay. If you more or less follow this simple "play style" through the game, you'll be strong enough to battle against pretty much every boss. That works best if you are the exploring type, since that'd mean you'd face more monsters. If somehow a boss is absurdly strong, you have to question yourself about two things: if you are playing right against him, or if somehow you are blatantly underleveled (which shouldn't normally happen). If somehow the case is the latter, that means you'll get levels pretty quickly. However, if it takes too long to level up just once, it probably means something else is missing: perhaps you didn't buy yourself the best armors available, or didn't find a certain weapon orb which you should already have, or something is missing in your strategy against the given boss. I personally don't think I have previously found myself in such a situation though. Usually, I was just fighting wrong against the boss, or at times I skipped enemies on purpose, only to get punished later. xD I remember in this one temple, there were some switches you needed to activate using magic, and there were also lots of enemies that could only be killed with magic. I figured that obviously the designers wouldn't be stupid or perhaps cruel enough to make me spend my MP on those fellows if I was gonna need it for switches up ahead. But unfortunately I did, and then an hour of my life had been lost on nothing. By then it was too late for me to know I was supposed to ignore those enemies. Also, I don't remember having that much MP to spare. Did you gain more MP as you levelled up your magic? Because in that case I definitely didn't have much MP to spare. Hmmm, I wonder what dungeon that was... (perhaps the one in the desert?) Anyway, to raise MP, you level up your character, not your magic. Maximum MP per character is 99. The nut heals 50. The sprite later on also learns a drain magic of sorts, which simply sucks the MP from a target to you. Also, in your case, I think there are many things you could do or have done. For example, if you activated a few switches with magic, if I recall correctly, they will still be activated when you leave the dungeon and return, meaning you would have not wasted your time, also because you got to know things better. Anyway, you can instantly exit from a dungeon using the Magic Rope, and then run to the most nearby town. There's also the option to use the Magic Nut, even though it'd be best to save those for bosses. (By the way, later on they aren't expensive since monsters will start giving you loads of money.) That's it, I guess. I'm still blown away by all the Secret of Mana hate in here. Never in my life have I encountered ANYONE who's disliked the game, much less TWO PEOPLE ON THE SAME BOARD. Absolute craziness! It's like disliking Chrono Trigger... it just doesn't happen! -Tom xD Yeah, I'm also amazed. XD However, yeah, disliking Chrono Trigger... is it even possible? What I know is that there are aaaall kinds of people in this world, so... why not. At least we all agree Chrono Trigger kicks ass, no? Oh, by the way, there's still one thing. Perhaps the game just isn't for you guys. Even if after all I said, you still can't help, but to dislike it, then I guess that's it. It's just that it isn't everyday I see someone disliking SoM, but no problem with that. A general rule for games though is that one shouldn't dismiss it until it's finished or something, since there may be something later on that might get the player more interested, or, just like what happened with Wyrdwad concerning Ys V, the game may grow on the player. It depends.
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Post by Justin on Dec 23, 2009 18:45:15 GMT -5
Its great, but after running through it 2 or 3 times, its magic has somewhat worn off. I still really like the music though.
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Post by HJ on Dec 23, 2009 19:45:59 GMT -5
Well, I'm not gonna address most of your points tonight since I'm feeling lazy, but unless you're a reviewer, you should never play through an entire game just to see if it has something good at the end. Because if what leads up to the end all sucks, then it's still a bad game no matter how great the final boss and/or ending might be.
I've only played the DS version of Chrono Trigger (am I late enough guys??) btw, but it was great.
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Post by Red Hairdo on Dec 23, 2009 20:17:27 GMT -5
Well, I guess that's true. When I play a game that I don't enjoy from the start or so, I search for opinions of other people to see what I may get at.
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Post by HJ on Dec 23, 2009 21:14:53 GMT -5
Yeah, I tend to do that too. Deciding when to stop is a fine balance, I guess. Quitting if the tutorial didn't rock your world isn't exactly a smart thing to do either.
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Post by Ascended Mermaid on Dec 24, 2009 1:49:36 GMT -5
...and in Prinny's case, give it to a coworker, lol! That's what I'm hoping to happen with SoM though, that it'll grow on me. I still like Sword's engine, music, story, scenario, graphics... everything much better. HOWEVER, of all the Mana games? Legend of Mana has the best graphics; even though it was pretty much a beat em' up with RPG elements, and a damn good one at that! Given I already have a love for Mana as a series, it's a secret as to why I dislike SoM. There are things to like, for sure. The second half of the boss battle theme. The theme for the town west of Potos. The cute monsters and characters. The field theme. The seasonal forest theme. The seasonal forest itself. The crystal forest (or whatever) for that Christmas-y scenario. So that's basically it; a few BGM and some graphics. You know, the cosmetic aspects.
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Post by Incog Neato on Dec 24, 2009 6:16:42 GMT -5
I always welcome Secret of Mana hate. That game has TOO MUCH LOVE. :P
Seriously, there are games where I might have not have liked much before and willing to give another shot but SoM is NOT one of them. :3
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Post by Disgaeamad on Dec 24, 2009 8:00:48 GMT -5
I feel compelled to get the "Leave Britney Alone!" transcript and make it match this situation.
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Post by Ascended Mermaid on Dec 24, 2009 10:08:17 GMT -5
LEAVE MANA ALONE!!! XD Bahaha...
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Post by Justin on Dec 24, 2009 12:05:15 GMT -5
I've only played the DS version of Chrono Trigger (am I late enough guys??) btw, but it was great. Heh, a little late, but its great to see you liked it. By the time the DS version came out though, I'd already jammed a few times on the SNES version, and then again on the crappy PSX version. Needless to say, after I was done with the DS one, I was pretty CT'ed out haha.
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Post by Ascended Mermaid on Dec 24, 2009 15:50:47 GMT -5
If I hate anything in SoM right now, it's the map. Yep. The map. I hate it. There's no explanation as to WHERE you can land, and because you don't use the map AT ALL in the first half of the game, it's IMPOSSIBLE to know where you are and where you're going! Incredibly disorienting! At least with Final Fantasy VI, you're able to get a feel for the map -- but in SoM, you're just thrown right into it.
I wouldn't even NEED an internet map if the game had a detailed map with a list of all the locales and actually MARKED where you could land. That, or a MENU would be nice!
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Post by HJ on Dec 24, 2009 19:39:44 GMT -5
I never liked the map either... or lack thereof. Anyway, all this mana talk has convinced me to try out the PSP's emulating capabilities and play SoM again. By which I, of course, mean Sword of Mana. No need to ruin Christmas break by playing Secret of Mana, right? Just kidding, I might try Secret of Mana again after Sword, if I can stand the terribly downgraded gameplay.
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